Stan Kasten Should Not Fire Ned Colletti

Posted on March 29, 2012 by Mike Petriello 161 Replies

…at least not now, anyway.

I’ve been seeing a surprising amount of unhappiness from Dodger fans over a series of notes from Bill Shaikin, Dylan Hernandez, and Tim Brown, who all claim that Stan Kasten not only plans to make no immediate moves in the front office, but that he has a good relationship with Ned Colletti, even meeting for dinner a few weeks ago. Since so many of us have been saying for so long that the potential of new ownership pushing Colletti out might be even more beneficial from a baseball perspective than Frank McCourt leaving, this has been taken in some quarters as a sign that we may yet be stuck with Colletti for some time to come. Fire up the red alarms, right?

To which I say: well, of course this is what’s happening. Say what you want about Ned Colletti – and believe me, I have – but I have yet to read a single report of anyone finding him anything less than friendly and personable. There’s a big difference between “being a terrible general manager” and “being an awful person”, and by all indications, Colletti’s the kind of guy who gets along with everyone and has few enemies in the business. Beyond that, Colletti & Kasten have mutual friends and Colletti was well aware that he was speaking to a man who very well might be his boss soon, and the real story here would have been if we were hearing that the two men weren’t getting along.

It works that way from Kasten’s end, too. Hey, he may very well plan to come in and fire Colletti. You know that I hope he does, because all of the stories you read about how Colletti’s hands were tied because of McCourt’s lowered payrolls are complete garbage. But when he says things like “I go in assuming everyone is doing their job properly” and that he wants to support the current team, keep in mind that it’s really the only thing he can say. Even if it was a good idea to fire the general manager the week before the season starts – spoiler alert: it’s not – don’t forget that Kasten and company don’t officially take power until May 1. Though it may be entertaining to imagine Kasten coming out and saying “Colletti? Ha, that guy is so unemployed, remember when he gave $117m to Jason Schmidt, Juan Pierre, & Andruw Jones?” it of course makes absolutely no sense for him to start a public turmoil by saying that now when he couldn’t even follow through on it for another month.

I still think Colletti will be long gone by this time next year, and perhaps even by the July trading deadline if the team is struggling this season. But it’s not going to happen right now, nor should it.

52 comments

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NickM

I beg to differ. Ned Colletti's hands were tied by McCourt's lack of money. Of course, he then proceeded to wrap them around his own neck, which wasn't McCourt's doing.

Mike Bindman

The only GM I'd want at the helm is Pat Gillick. End of story. Check out his resume... He's a winner.

Franky

I want the greek god of trades

Ned Colletti

I am looking forward to working for the new Dodger ownership group for years to come. The success I have built here in the past few years will continue to be built upon. We have had competitive teams in the past and we will have competitive teams in our future.

DodgersKingsoftheGalaxy

May 1st, i can keep up my boycott until then

Green Lantern

I know this might seem somewhat controversial, so I should probably preface this by saying I am not a Ned Colletti fan. I'm really not. I would love to see a new GM in LA. Having said that, I do think Colletti has gotten a bit of a bad rap. The Schmidt and Pierre signings were garbage. The recent signings of has-beens and never-weres is puzzling. The Trayvon Robinson trade is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen. On the other hand, he was ridiculed by other GM's when he traded for Ethier. That worked out well. He got Manny for a song, which was awesome. We can ridicule that he picked up castoffs like Carroll and Miles, but they contributed more than any of us would have expected. And now it looks like Kemp will be a Dodger for a long time. What really gets me, though, is the hindsight reaction to the Casey Blake/Carlos Santana trade. He really gets hit hard for that. Of course I would LOVE to have Santana on this roster, but let's be realistic. The Dodgers DO NOT make the playoffs in 2008 without Blake. There isn't a doubt in my mind. They may well not make it in 2009 either. As a Dodger fan, if I know my team has a chance to trade a top prospect and future all-star for the opportunity to make two playoff appearances, I absolutely pull that trigger. I wish we had Santana, but let's not act like 2008 and 2009 never happened.

Bip

Regarding Miles: giving a spring training invite to a player with major league experience is not really representative of skill as a GM. It's a total low risk roll of the dice, and every GM does it. Plus, Miles really hardly contributed anything. Justin Sellers probably would have done just as well. - We'll always have to wonder how many of Ned's good trades can be explained by "throw enough shit against the wall" theory. All we can really do is judge the process and see whether the results could have been expected. If the process is good, then some unexpected failures don't invalidate it; likewise, Ned doesn't seem to have much of a process besides signing washed up vets, so perhaps we shouldn't let his unexpected successes validate him.

Green Lantern

Look, I really don't mean to come off as an apologist. I just think there has been some historical revision over the last few years. I think a lot of people are dismissing the fact that the trade for Manny was pretty controversial at the time. The Dodgers gave up nothing. They got two playoff appearances. The Santana/Blake trade gets beaten up regularly. Like everyone else, I would love to have Santana right now. But so many Dodger fans act like Casey Blake was some sort of bust when he did exactly what you would want from a player you trade for in those circumstances. I guess I'm jaded because I'm stuck in Northern California. The hosts of the Giants station (680) were just talking about how horrible the Dodgers have been and how they have not been competitive in years. One of the hosts mentioned how he thought they may have made one (ONE!) playoff appearance under McCourt but he wasn't sure. Everyone has been acting like the Dodgers have been comparable to the 1899 Cleveland Spiders over the last few years. The reality is that the forced sale saved them from becoming something like that.

Coffey looks like he could become expandable possible for the Macy's Thanksgiving Day parade in NY.

Jon#7#22

In hindsight yes, but at the time they gave up LaPorta, Jackson, Bryson (solid RP prospect) and Michael Brantley. In terms of pre season ratings the Brewers gave up more. In terms of the current season Santana was having and what he is doing now, yeah the Dodgers gave up way more. Interestingly enough, Brantley was the player to be named later in the deal and actually has probably the best chance of being a serviceable big leaguer our of all 4 the Indians got! We all agree we should have gotten more than Blake I think though!

Mike

Have to disagree with you Dave, because Paul is right on. If I can quote this very site from four years ago... This season, Santana, who is 22 years old, has been hitting the living crap out of the ball, putting up a line of .323/.431/.563 with a .994 OPS and 14 HR’s. Remember, he’s a catcher… a switch-hitting catcher… and to find a catcher putting up those numbers is mighty impressive and some have argued that he is already, if not close, to becoming the organization’s best hitting prospect. While Russell Martin is firmly established as the catcher, it’s still not wise to trade someone putting up these numbers for a three month rental of Casey Blake, even if the player could become expandable. Trade him for Jason Bay, Matt Holliday, etc.? Great. Just not Casey Blake. Selling high is one thing, but you also need to get a good return, as well.

Dave Pomerantz

That's just simply not true. The Brewers gave up their #1 prospect, Matt LaPorta, who was ranked the #23 prospect in all of baseball prior to that season, plus 3 other minor leaguers. Santana was just coming into his own as a prospect, and was not even among the Dodgers' top 10 prior to 2008. He had never played above A ball, and was fairly awful in 2007. The Dodgers only gave up 1 other player, wild thing Jon Meloan, also not a ranked prospect.

Paul

Milwaukee gave up less for Sabathia than we did for Blake.

Jon#7#22

Right on Dave. I always seem to agree with you. It wasn't that Santana was traded it was that we probably could have gotten more. CC Sabathia? Um no anyone thinking that must be smoking crack, but maybe some other useful piece or at least a high upside prospect or something, only getting Blake for 1/2 season was the problem. Coletti's a mixed bag. He's had some good moves, some middle of the road and a few klunkers that really stick out and have been costly.

Dave Pomerantz

I think in regard to the Santana/Blake trade it's also worth pointing out that, at the time, everyone thought the Dodgers had a young catcher who had just appeared in his second straight all-star game, and appeared to be the answer for years to come. Doesn't forgive the fact that Ned might have been able to get more for Santana, but all the people who look at the lack of anything approaching a decent catcher on the roster, and yell about Santana forget that Martin appeared to be set for years at the time.

DodgersKingsoftheGalaxy

That was all thanks to Red Sox/Pirates and Manny.

Green Lantern

Yep, but someone had to take advantage of that. Let's not forget that Manny was considered a cancer at the time. Colletti took advantage of that. I can't believe I'm defending the guy....

Paul

I know Mike has stated this several times, but at the risk of sounding like a follower, the problem with the Santana trade wasn't the fact that we dealt a great prospect; it's the fact that we could have had so much more in return. Most people felt we could have easily picked up CC Sabathia, and don't try to tell me that Casey Blake contributed more to our playoff push than having a true #1 fronting that rotation. We might very well have beat Philly.

Green Lantern

I don't know if they could have picked up Sabathia. But if they had, remember two things: 1. Sabathia would have been a free agent after 2008, so they would have not had him for the 2009 season. 2. Sabathia was absolutely better than Blake in the 2008 season, but we made the playoffs either way. Take a look at Sabathia's one playoff appearance in 2008 and explain to me how that helps the Dodgers.

Mike

Well, don't forget that Blake was a free agent after 2008 as well. Exactly the same thing. And the Brewers had to ride CC like crazy down the stretch that year just to make the playoffs. Wouldn't have been the case in LA.

Ny Blues

Is Logan White someone who could be the GM? Nobody knows the Dodgers better.

Brandon

or Kim Ng. I'd actually be open to giving DePo a second look. He wasn't so bad the first time around and he's been working for some of the game's better GMs the last 7 years.

Dave Pomerantz

DePo, to me, is always going to be a guy who's great sitting in the chair right next to the GM. He doesn't seem to have the people skills, media savvy, or negotiating prowess to be the top guy, and those are things you can't really get from assistants.

jWerthfan

...when Ned is gone. [happy hour]

jWerthfan

LOL'd at 'he has no enemies in the business'. EVERY other GM loses their 'go to' guy, not to mention the agents of washed up retreads.

bleeddodgerblue

Any chance we pry Kim Ng away from the MLB front office?

Dave Pomerantz

I've got to think she'd jump at the chance to run a team. It would not be a lateral move.

Gillbert

As much as I want neddie goon, I agree. They can't kick him out day one. Plus, holding off gives them a good chance to see if white can be the GM or if they need to go outside. Here is an article on the parking lots. Seems Frank get no money from them for parking. He onley gets money from future developments. http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/mlb/story/_/id/7752934/frank-mccourt-receives-no-parking-revenue-los-angeles-dodgers-sources-say

DodgersKingsoftheGalaxy

*Puke* that shopping mall is going to happen?

Dave Pomerantz

I like the idea of having restaurants and bars to visit before or after games.

Bip

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/2012-organizational-rankings-19-los-angeles/ 29/30 in baseball operations. Also, I'm just trying to remember, who else did we give to the Cubs besides Dewitt for Lilly and Theriot?

Mike

Kyle Smit (just cut by the Cubs this month) and one of the lesser Wallachs. You know, I hated that deal at the time, largely because offense was the problem rather than pitching and Theriot sure as hell wasn't going to fix anything, but considering how little was given up, its worked out pretty well.

Bip

Yeah, it seemed like everyone hated that deal as much as the Dotel deal, which didn't make sense to me, since the Dotel deal was unequivocally terrible. It seems like with the Lilly deal, we both got more and gave up less.

sumdumfu

uncle Ned reminds me of one of my bosses at work; plump goofy dude sporting a mustache who's completely nice, but everybody hates his guts because his incompetent nincompoopery leads to more and harder work for us underlings.

Marshall

I'm not too familiar with Kasten, but what does his track record suggest? He kept Jim Bowden on for a few years until the scandal forced him to make a change. I don't know much about Bowden as a GM, but his "analysis" at ESPN can be laughable.

Turn on channel 42 for a very professional at bat: ellis

Rusty H.

Colletti probably knows just about as much of what has gone on with the Dodgers as anyone. It is only logical that he stays in the interim until Kasten can figure out what he has and develop a game plan to then reshape the entire organization.

Dave Pomerantz

I'm not sure I agree with that. The coaching staff would know the big league guys the best, DeJon Watson would know the guys in the minors the best, and Logan White would know which amateurs the team has been scouting.

canofcorn66

Of course Colletti "gets along with everyone"... Jack Z.: So, we were wondering about Trayvon Robinson - we can probably get you this catcher Federowicz, a few plus arms and -- Ned: We'll take it! Jack Z.: Aw Ned, you're the best! Let's go eat fried chicken. /scene

Jeff M.

This sounds like the dreaded "vote of confidence." How many times have we seen people let go after their boss says something like, "He's my guy" or "He's doing a heckuva job."?

Jon#7#22

Interesting stats on Wikipedia: The Dodgers' 511-460 (.526) record from 2006-2011 was third best among National League teams behind only the Phillies (.574) and Cardinals (.529). Among NL West teams, the Dodgers' record was 24 games better than second-best Colorado. During Colletti's first six seasons, the Dodgers compiled the best ERA and second-best batting average in the National League. Colletti reached 500 wins as a General Manager on Sept. 9, 2011, when Clayton Kershaw beat Tim Lincecum and the Giants 2-1 in San Francisco. The win came in Colletti's 953rd game as GM. Only Buzzie Bavasi (895 games) reached the 500-win mark faster in Dodger history. Not saying we should keep Coletti but makes sense as least for Kasten to give him a chance and get to know the team, but I think he's gone after this year.

Mike

This leads into a larger conversation, but how many of those wins came on the backs of players who Logan White drafted and Paul DePodesta acquired?

Jon#7#22

Agreed Mike. Thought they were interesting stats kinda like as important as RBI's and runs scored! Also looks like Coletti's PR guy wrote up the wikipedia article!

Paul

Would like to take this opportunity to draw the distinction between lowercase paul and uppercase Paul. That is all.

paul

Wins are wins, deal with it. I love how statheads denigrate the old stats..mind you I love the new sabermetrics as well, but the ultimate number is wins..Depo was the ultimate anti-social, couldn't even face players when they got traded....ask LoDuca....at least Ned has the quevos for that!

Jeff M.

That happens more often than you'd think. You want something nice said about you, say it yourself!

Tony M. Fernández

And Dan Evans, though who even remembers him or what he accomplished. I will say that the only way that Colletti's hands have been tied have been with the farm system. Sure, we supposedly have domestic signings, but international signings are absolutely flat. It's hard to engineer big time trades when your farm system is so depleted. In no way am I excusing the lousy signings or the ludicrous trades that have happened, but this is one area where money actually has been the problem.

BMcD

Colletti should be canned immediately... For having given interviews in front of the Angels logo.

Jeff M.

Heh heh! I didn't even notice that.

SamAdams

You gave the near perfect description of our last two GM's as "Being a: Terrible General Manager"--Colletti "Awful Person"(ality)--DePo.

badger3

But, DePo is one of your stathead guys. And don't forget Fortune Magazine named him as one of the Top 10 innovators under the age of 40. . I think Colletti will eventually be let go. Most new regimes want their own choice in there. Who is available?

Ishii-Mania

Don't forget my all-time least favorite "new sheriff" Kevin Malone.

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